My experience with zoa eating nudi's

[gwen_o_lyn]

I am pasting this over from another board- this may be a helpful thread if anyone here has this problem. Sorry, but I can't give out frags from the 72g until the problem is over.

October 5th: Received "Diver's Den" Pink Zoanthid rock from LiveAquaria :thumbs:

October 11th: notice the polyps aren't opening and I discover the <span style="color: black;">nudibranchs.</span> :boo: I picked as many as I could, did a 3 minute freshwater dip on just that rock, and scraped what could have been eggs from the zoas.

October 12th: I was rushing out the door and late for work, I shined a flashlight at my other zoas and sure enough, they have spread.

I was debating whether or not to call LiveAquaria. This is the first time I've ordered anything live online that had to be shipped. Spoke to a super sweet lady named Laura. They did EVERYTHING RIGHT when it comes to customer service. She apologized NUMEROUS times, was very sincere, said she felt so terrible, and overall fixed the situation. They DID NOT question me about if I was sure they came from their zoas or somewhere else. I received the $69.99 for the rock, $34.99 for shipping, AND another $50 for the hassle. She said I could have store credit or have it put back on my card. I choose store credit since I felt they did everything right and wanted to put the money back into their company. She didn't know a solution, but had a manager call me back within an hour to suggest a way to help me out.

<span style="color: black;">The manager suggested a product called Pro Coral Cure and I think she said a FW dip too? They even went as far as suggesting a product they don't even sell, something rare, just to try to help me out. My LFS doesn't have this. My friend had sent me an email earlier in the day on something he found online saying Flatworm Exit and FW dip. The flatworm exit may not help as much, but I buy it anyway.

I took out most the zoas on the right side of the tank and FW dipped them for about 5-10 minutes. I also put a few drops of Flatworm exit. They were dieing before the Flatworm Exit went in, but I wanted to make sure they were extra dead. Once I hit the frags/rocks with a turkey baster, the nudi's were flying all over the place!!

There are 2 in the picture and one is about the size of "RICA" on a penny. Very small.</span>

<span style="color: black;">October 13th </span><span style="color: black;">05:43 PM :</span> I shined the flashlight in the tank this morning and did not spot<span style="color: black;"> any nudi's. As of right now with the lights on, I can't see any.

The zoas that were dipped all on the right side of the tank are in so-so condition. I dipped about 10 "flavors" and about 50% of the polyps are opened on all types across the board.

The pink zoas that the nudi's came on were dipped twice 2 nights in a row and they have less than 1/4 polyps open.

I speculate a few reasons:
1) the nudi's did some damage
2) they were FW dipped, Flatworm exit was added to the dip
3) I added PhosGuard to the tank for</span> the first time ever last night

The zoanthids on the left side of the tank seem to be behaving normal, polyps fully open. There are some green zoas in the center that were not dipped and are the closest to the infected zoas. These green zoas have 4 polyps that look upset.

<span style="color: black;">11:02 PM:</span> I am told that Flatworm Exit will kill them. I just dosed the tank according to the directions and took out the carbon..... now would be a good time to play "let the bodies hit the floor"

11:21 PM: I just reinspected the green zoas in the center and they are indeed infected. I can see 2 of them in the tank now... I am hoping the exit will kill them....

Oct 14, 2006, 12:17 AM:
I have been reading threads over on RC- it's very depressing. I have found threads started, and one year later the original poster still has<span style="color: black;"> the nudi's.</span>

No one mentions Flatworm Exit as a cure.

One hour after dosing Flatworm Exit, they are still crawling on my zoas....

08:58 PM: Start a thread here asking for help. The plan is to get all the zoas out and into <span style="color: black;">a QT tank. Any zoas left will be scrubbed with a toothbrush or eatin by nudi's. Then the nudi's in the display will starve and the zoas in QT will be FW dipped many many times.</span>

As of right now, I can't <span style="color: black;">spot any nudi's but I do see a clutch of eggs. I did more dipping last night.

The pink zoa rock from LiveAquaria that the nudi's came in on look good and if I work hard, I shouldn't lose any of my zoas.</span>

Oct 15, 2006, 07:52 PM: I picked up the tank today (THANKS SALLY!) and I'm just waiting for the temp to rise. I was able to borrow a tank, lights, and an AquaC Remora/MJ1200. I<span style="color: black;"> plan to FW dip</span> all the zoas and then put them in the QT.

Oct 17, 2006, 08:14 PM: So all the zoas are in the 10g tank. They were all <span style="color: black;">FW dipped</span> at room temp water that has not been <span style="color: black;">adjusted for </span><span style="color: black;">PH</span><span style="color: black;">. When I did this in the 72g and put the zoas back in the 72g, the recovery time was much faster.

Just think, I took the zoas out the 72g, dipped several minutes into </span><span style="color: black;">FW</span><span style="color: black;"> (PH and temp was off & prolly many other things), and into another tank for treatment. You would be in shock too!! After 24 hours all the zoas were still closed. Tonite (48 hours) a few of the polyps have started to open. I really thought I did major damage, but I see hope now. I gotta lay off the dips for a few days.

Things I have learned- </span><span style="color: black;">FW</span><span style="color: black;"> dips will kill SPS</span><span style="color: black;">. I wasn't expecting the SPS to live, but now I know for sure. Lost many hitchhikers while dipping too. Although, I was amazed to find one snail and one asterina that made it through </span><span style="color: black;">FW</span><span style="color: black;"> dips.

As of now, I haven't noticed any eggs. I gotta let the zoas fully open and look good before I can dip again. I may match temp and </span><span style="color: black;">PH</span><span style="color: black;"> this</span> time and hope for a faster recovery.

Oct 18-22: Zoas are opening more and more each day. As of right now 95%+ of the polyps are fine. The closed ones were prolly damaged by nudi's. I haven't seen any eggs or nudi's and I haven't dipped again. There are several upset zoas in the 72g although I haven't spotted any nudi's- the glass is a little dirty.
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[wolfie]

glad to hear you having thing handle.

 

[kappaknight]

So there's nothing that eats these things?

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

I remember reading something about natural predators, but I can't find any information right now.

I think they were harder to keep fish that needed larger setups, but I'm not sure where I read that.

 

[burdundi]

Hey Gwen,

Here is a post about a fish that will take them out.

Sea Grass Wrasse.

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=533167">http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=533167</a>

I have also heard of adding iodine with the flatworm exit to the freshwater dip. I'll see if I can find the thread on that.

Andy

 

[burdundi]

You probably already saw this about the Zoa dip, but just in case:

http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=451720">http://www.reefcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=451720</a>

Andy

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

Thanks Burdundi.

I added flatworm exit during the first few dips when the zoas were in the 72g and I added it to the main tank also. I will check into that fish.

Tonite I did another FW dip for 5-10 minutes. I added 4 drops of Flatworm Exit and one capful of Iodine (thanks BurdundI) to about 1.5g of RO. I think the IO may have helped since I've already have zoas opening up. I carefully inspected all zoas for eggs and nudi's and none were found. I will prolly dip one more time in a week just to be sure.

I scrubbed the remaining zoas out of the 72g as best as I could. I'd rather not take a chance.

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

It looked like my zoas were a little hungry in the isolation tank, so I put a few back in the 72g. I carefully inspected for nudi's and eggs, but don't see any. I will keep a close eye on them though since they may be in the 72g still.

Here are the zoas the nudi's came on and they are back in the 72g. They look good. :up:
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[kevin]

Nice shot gwen. good luck with it.

 

[showtime305]

Those zoos look great. Are you still treating others?

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

Thanks

Not really treating the others at the moment. I think I got the nudi's out of the QT- it's the 72g I worry about. I stuck a few zoas in there now to see how they do.

 

[nomad37]

Do these critters feed on anything else like mushrooms, etc.?

Nomad37

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

I believe they will only eat zoas.

Most nudi's are known for just eating one thing *i think*

 

[kappaknight]

I think I have this now too... I can't pinpoint the source they came in on since I received frags from a few sources at the most recent meeting... but if you have zoas and they're also starting to close, be on the look out.

 

[stanfill reef]

I dipped all of my frags from the meeting before placing them in a QT tank. I only recieved frags from ARC at the meeting, but do not see any problems in my QT tank. So either my dip worked or the ARC frag was not infected.

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

Wei- that REALLY sucks especially with your large zoa collection.

Let me know how you plan on getting rid of them.

 

[pnguye3]

http://www.zomania.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=page_3&zenid=0e5071a3f6c0fa690154320194eb9fab">http://www.zomania.com/catalog/index.php?main_page=page_3&zenid=0e5071a3f6c0fa690154320194eb9fab</a>

This is an article that from [IMG]http://www.zomania.com">www.zomania.com</a> that uses the Salifert Flatworm Exit. I've tried it before, but I had to use about twice the dosage as what it said on the package of SFE.

Good Luck Wei... hope this works for ya..

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

pnguye3- did you have nudi's or were u treating flatworms?

How long did you have them? How long have they been gone for?

 

[pnguye3]

I had originally used them for flatworms, but then i found a few nudis like a month afterwards in my zoos. I did an initial test by filling a bowl up w/ tank water and then putting some SFE in it. I placed one of my zoo rocks into that bowl and let it sit for about 10 minutes. When I pulled out that rock, the nudis had fallen off...and were dead. So, I dosed my tank...didnt run carbon for about a day or so. My tank at the time was only a 16 bow...and I rid it of the nudis from what I can tell.

 

[gwen_o_lyn]

I think the eggs are the real nightmare. I went 2 months thinking everything was fine. No sign of nudi's and my zoas were always open and looking good. And now they are back.

How long has it been since you have seen them?