My thought with the committee picking the final is that the judges could provide a synopsis on why they picked the winner. Also seems cleaner IMHO
How should we conduct contests?
- Thread starter ActiveAngel
- Start date
How about each Committee Member picks their top five awarding five points for their favorite then 4, 3, 2 and 1 on down. Top 5 aggregate scores are made finalists
That's similar how we have done a couple of them when our decisions differed slightly amongst the top 5. Conversations helped us to understand what each of us saw in each photo, and how we personally rated them.
Otherwise, good conversations so far!
My plan is for: In a couple days, I will open a poll about "how to conduct photos"... I'll include the initial 3 options, and any unique variants discussed here.
Everyone, please put in your last two cents to flush out any ideas that you want in the poll.
I want to make the poll now/soon, summarizing each of the options discussed with as much details as we have flushed out here.
But for each option discussing "popular votes" (either by members only, all accounts, or some other metric), Do we have a volunteer to do the posting/editing of polls (each month or as needed) in a way that is equally fair to each entry?
The reason we aren't doing it now is because of the extra work, especially to keep it fair, and I kinda need more people to help carry the load. If one of those options is selected, then that would put us in the position of choosing between "ignoring the people's choice" or "not having contests"... and I dont want to be in that position.
After the poll concludes, you can flush out some SOPs (for chosen option) before the end of March, and we can review and amend if necessary... and then implement them for the first time in a couple weeks. =]
But for each option discussing "popular votes" (either by members only, all accounts, or some other metric), Do we have a volunteer to do the posting/editing of polls (each month or as needed) in a way that is equally fair to each entry?
The reason we aren't doing it now is because of the extra work, especially to keep it fair, and I kinda need more people to help carry the load. If one of those options is selected, then that would put us in the position of choosing between "ignoring the people's choice" or "not having contests"... and I dont want to be in that position.
After the poll concludes, you can flush out some SOPs (for chosen option) before the end of March, and we can review and amend if necessary... and then implement them for the first time in a couple weeks. =]
Good morning everyone! In a matter of bumping the above question, Do we have a volunteer to help with making the polls (each month)? This isn't a guarantee that it will be required... only if the public votes on deciding contests by voting (either as a first or last step).
I would be more than happy to manage polls and contest threads, I have some experience with it on R2R and y'all use the same engine.
I'm going to post this below. Let me know if you have disagreements/edits. I think this summarizes the options concisely.
If I think of more, I'll also edit this post.
----
Title: How to choose contest winners?
Follow-up question: Should only members get votes, or all ARC accounts?
Option A)
Use emojis/likes/loves to count popularity. Biggest number wins.
Almost instantly fast (5/5). Zero/Low effort (1/5).
Committee of volunteers chooses winner. Open to anybody that wants to have a vote.
Also fast (4/5). Low effort (2/5).
Committee first chooses top 5*ish photos, then constructs blind poll of the top 5*. Popular vote on the poll is winner.
Slow (2/5). Moderate effort (3/5).
Committee member constructs blind poll of all photos. The Poll's top 5 photos go to committee, to discuss and choose the final winner.
Slow (2/5). High effort (5/5).
...
After this text, the poll will give them the choices:
Option A
Option B
Option C
Option D
If I think of more, I'll also edit this post.
----
Title: How to choose contest winners?
Follow-up question: Should only members get votes, or all ARC accounts?
Option A)
Use emojis/likes/loves to count popularity. Biggest number wins.
Almost instantly fast (5/5). Zero/Low effort (1/5).
- Pros: 100% transparency for anyone that wants to count the likes at midnight.
- Cons:Significant bias for first few people who post photos. Late submissions unlikely to win, regardless of photo.
- Bias for people with followers.
- High probability of repeat winners each month.
- Question of how to weigh "loves" and other symbols, notably in the case of ties.
- Potential for cheating if users create multiple accounts.
Committee of volunteers chooses winner. Open to anybody that wants to have a vote.
Also fast (4/5). Low effort (2/5).
- Pros: Discussion between voters can mitigate temporal/individual bias... and focus on merits of the contest parameters.
- Cons:Appears non-transparent (users can always review photos independently, choose to be in voting conversation, and/or ask committee).
- Conflict of Interest for voters not being able to be eligible to win... until committee size is large enough.
Committee first chooses top 5*ish photos, then constructs blind poll of the top 5*. Popular vote on the poll is winner.
Slow (2/5). Moderate effort (3/5).
- Pros:Poll results are transparent.
- Polls can remove username to remove bias.
- Small number of photos are more likely to be reviewed "in full" by voters.
- Cons:Still non-transparent for the committee (unless people want to participate or ask).
- Still Conflict of Interest for voters.
- Voting Bias during final selection (e.g., voters choosing a rare corals, rather than on photo characteristics or contest parameters)
- Potential cheating with multiple accounts can determine winner, if not regulated.
Committee member constructs blind poll of all photos. The Poll's top 5 photos go to committee, to discuss and choose the final winner.
Slow (2/5). High effort (5/5).
- Pros: Poll results are transparent.
- Poll can remove username to remove bias
- Committee can discuss and judge final selection based on merit of the contest.
- Cons: Still non-transparent for the committee (unless people want to participate or ask).
- Potential 'first selection' bias during poll (Users may not be willing to spend time to view large number of photos.)
- Still Conflict of Interest for voters.
- May result in users disagreeing with committee selection.
...
After this text, the poll will give them the choices:
Option A
Option B
Option C
Option D
Last edited:
It's a tough tie between C and D for me. I like the balance of effort and transparency of option C, and since we get less traffic than a place like R2R the cons of D may be even more pronounced (First few options being selected more than others).
@Hunna @Jikkermanccini
Thank you both for volunteering to help with the Poll!
Notes: Unfortunately, the poll option doesn't address the issue presented (e.g., dball's shrooms)... but it does give voters the final say in the winner. Still, if we choose a top 5, it's always possible that #6+ could be upset to not make the cut. And so on if we were to do a Top 6, Top 7, Top 8, etc... At the end of the day, if someone wants to know, they must either 1) volunteer to vote, 2) be part of the conversation, 3) ask afterwards, or 4) take a little time to objectively review the photos. As always, communication is key. Those that have been in the conversation know I have nothing against Dave, but I hope that he knows that. His photos are always incredible, and it hurts me to see when he's upset.
I digress. I'm satisfied with how this conversation and the poll is going, and thankful for everyone's input and participation!
As always, please let me know if I may count any of you as part of the Contest Committee. We've had just two of us for a while... and I'd love to have more people in on the conversations.
Thank you both for volunteering to help with the Poll!
Notes: Unfortunately, the poll option doesn't address the issue presented (e.g., dball's shrooms)... but it does give voters the final say in the winner. Still, if we choose a top 5, it's always possible that #6+ could be upset to not make the cut. And so on if we were to do a Top 6, Top 7, Top 8, etc... At the end of the day, if someone wants to know, they must either 1) volunteer to vote, 2) be part of the conversation, 3) ask afterwards, or 4) take a little time to objectively review the photos. As always, communication is key. Those that have been in the conversation know I have nothing against Dave, but I hope that he knows that. His photos are always incredible, and it hurts me to see when he's upset.
I digress. I'm satisfied with how this conversation and the poll is going, and thankful for everyone's input and participation!
As always, please let me know if I may count any of you as part of the Contest Committee. We've had just two of us for a while... and I'd love to have more people in on the conversations.
@Hunna @Jikkermanccini
It appears Option C is far in the lead at the moment.
I'd like for you both to consider the procedures of how we will conduct the Poll (after we narrow down to a top 5*) to vote on photos.
Below are my thoughts:
...I am happy to provide details, answer questions, or give you my experience. But at the end of the day, it's your baby. And your choice has my support!
It appears Option C is far in the lead at the moment.
I'd like for you both to consider the procedures of how we will conduct the Poll (after we narrow down to a top 5*) to vote on photos.
Below are my thoughts:
- It ought to allow multiple votes per person.
- ranking of votes is optional. not necessary. potentially useful, but added complexity.
- Who will get to vote?
- (e.g., Members only, all ARC accounts, accounts of X age and/or post count)
- How will you validate votes at the time of contest end?
- optional: How will you restrict votes in the poll to help filter these requirements?
- If its a photo contest, then only photos should be presented.
- No usernames and No photo titles... as those may influence voters.
- Keep it simple.
- How will photos be presented?
- Will they be downloaded and re-uploaded?
- Randomized order?
- How will we standardize photo size in the final voting poll... amongst differing aspect ratios?
...I am happy to provide details, answer questions, or give you my experience. But at the end of the day, it's your baby. And your choice has my support!
I agree, each voter should have 5 votes to put where they wish (the nature of these polls only allows one vote per option per person). I don't think a vote ranking would be practical.
I think all ARC accounts should be allowed, but none younger than 30 days with fewer than 25 meaningful posts. "Meaningful" meaning more than just comments like "Nice tank!". I would volunteer to check these.
No usernames, however photo titles may be fun. I think we'll have to use our own discretion.
Photos should be downloaded and re-uploaded by whoever starts the thread. I would be willing to do this if we need a routine.
Order should definitely be randomized.
I don't think we need anything special for aspect ratios, the formatting shouldn't be too hard to figure out.
These additional stipulations that are being suggested for members or member status will have to be verified by the contest committee so keep that in mind. Also, anyone found to be cheating by creating accounts to vote will be banned for violating ARC's code of conduct, so there may not need to be additional rules in place within a contest.
More questions for us!
How do we wish to hand tie-breakers in the final poll counts?
previously methods we considered to handle tie-breakers:
How do we wish to hand tie-breakers in the final poll counts?
previously methods we considered to handle tie-breakers:
- Using the number of 'likes' or 'loves' on a post, with 'loves' being weighted slightly more than 'likes'.
- Seeking third party judgement between contest finalists.
- ...if one contestant had recently been the winner within the past 1-2 months, the committee may choose to 'spread the well' by acknowledging the individual that hasn't won recently. At the time of writing this, this has never occurred. But we do wish to share the gifts to all the wonderful people of the ARC rather than repeatedly rewarding only a single subset of individuals.
Also, do you wish for me to include your first name on the Contest FAQs page? Until approval, I will only include your username.
Who is on the contest committee?
Andrew @ActiveAngel
@Doberman13
@Hunna
@Jikkermanccini
Who is on the contest committee?
Andrew @ActiveAngel
@Doberman13
@Hunna
@Jikkermanccini
Not a problem here. Most folks know my real name anywho.
Likes or loves works for me for tie breakers. We want to encourage participation, but the best entry should win for each contest regardless of previous winnings in my view. If someone wins three times let’s discuss. The committee has $500 for the year, if the team decides to award an honorable mention for someone that is most improved, most creative take on a theme, etc…go for it.
Hey guys! The Poll is closed and I announced the winner. Pardon the slight delay; I was bedridden with covid for a couple days, but I'm on my feet again, and back on the computer for work.
If you feel I jumped the gun with the announcement, and would like to implement other procedures prior; let me know and we can implement. But I wanted to make the announcement promptly, and think the poll is decisive.
@Doberman13 Did you find the meeting minutes to confirm what we discussed regarding contests? We can begin the conversation for the next contest. I have a few possible ideas, and am also open to hearing all of your ideas!
Also, @Jikkermanccini @Hunna @Doberman13 , what do you think about the 2 week timeframe on polls? I'm still leaning towards this being excessive and that maybe a 4-7 day poll may be an improvement... but that's just my thoughts. Otherwise, I think everything went well! What other observations and thoughts do yall have that you think we can apply to executing future contests?
Otherwise, I hope you all had a great month!
If you feel I jumped the gun with the announcement, and would like to implement other procedures prior; let me know and we can implement. But I wanted to make the announcement promptly, and think the poll is decisive.
@Doberman13 Did you find the meeting minutes to confirm what we discussed regarding contests? We can begin the conversation for the next contest. I have a few possible ideas, and am also open to hearing all of your ideas!
Also, @Jikkermanccini @Hunna @Doberman13 , what do you think about the 2 week timeframe on polls? I'm still leaning towards this being excessive and that maybe a 4-7 day poll may be an improvement... but that's just my thoughts. Otherwise, I think everything went well! What other observations and thoughts do yall have that you think we can apply to executing future contests?
Otherwise, I hope you all had a great month!
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