View Full Version : Another flatworm thread!


cr500_af
07-17-2010, 12:50 AM
This one does have a little twist to it, I suppose, because it has to do with recent discussions about anecdotal evidence vs actual experience. And I did search before posting. :)

Some FWs have appeared in my wife's tank (came in on a frag apparently).

I have three options as far as I know:
1. Flatworm Exit
2. Permanent fish that eats them
3. Temporary fish that eats them

Problem with #2: The only fish that might eat them and is small enough to live in a 30g cube would be a 666-line... and even then it's not a sure thing. I don't want to house the fish of the prince of darkness, especially if he may not earn his keep.

Problem with #3: The next logical choice is a Melanaurus Wrasse, and while I do have one in my 90g, I am quite sure I could never catch her in order to let her vacation in another tank.

Which leaves us with #1.

This brings us to the crux of the issue... I've read (in numerous FW threads) that somebody knew of somebody who had nuked a tank with FW Exit, and it is always hinted at as being risky. However, I've never seen anybody who had negative FIRST HAND info or experience post in those threads.

What I would like to know is this: Has anyone currently active in the club had a disaster with FW Exit? Assuming the directions are followed carefully and correctly, how real is the risk?

FWIW, the population is not too big right now, and the tank houses four fish, one RBTA and an assortment of softies and LPS... plus a couple of montipora caps.

Naturally, if there is an "option #4" I'm all ears.

DrNecropolis
07-17-2010, 12:54 AM
FW exit is pretty much a safe bet.. I'm willing to gamble that 90-95% of tanks that get nuked is from human error..

cr500_af
07-17-2010, 12:55 AM
I am thinking the same thing... what I want to know is where are the crashed tanks? It's never the tank of the person saying it.

Mockery
07-17-2010, 1:05 AM
Barry I have a friend who met a guy, then I met the same guy, and well his girlfriend's brother-in-law's mothers nuked her husbands tank using flatworm exit.



HAHA :lol2::lol2:I ran into the same thing when trying to find answer's about this. I could not find any first hand experience saying I nuked my tank using flatworm exit. If you follow the instructions you'll be fine. As for other fish choice look into the yellow coris wrasse or the 12 line wrasse. My yellow coris took care of the problem in a matter of days. As for the 12 line a LFS owner in CA puts all his frags/new corals in a tank with a 12 line for a few days and lets it pick the corals clean, he's has had no pest problem.

jmaneyapanda
07-17-2010, 7:20 AM
How many flat worms? That is the important question. The medication isnt dangerous, the dead flatworms are. So, as Colin said, follow the directions, and run carbon and water changes, and you'll be fine.

BASSCYN
07-17-2010, 7:46 AM
If you want some positive feedback, talk to the guy at Marine Design. He has used it on the tanks in his store and highly recommends the product.

JennM
07-17-2010, 8:33 AM
I am thinking the same thing... what I want to know is where are the crashed tanks? It's never the tank of the person saying it.

My tank crashed after using Flatworm eXit.

However it was not user error, nor was it the product itself.

I had such a severe infestation that the toxins from the sheer numbers of dead flatworms, caused my tank to crash.

http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f71/flatworm-exit-so-far-so-good-16537.html?highlight=Flatworm+eXit

There's another option too. Prazi Pro.

Jenn

Assault
07-17-2010, 8:39 AM
I know several people who nuked their tank using flat worm exit, but it was as Jenn stated, they had more worms in there than they realised, and the die off took its toll.

JennM
07-17-2010, 8:44 AM
BTW... if you happen to read the thread, the pair of false percs mentioned in the thread, is the same pair that are spawning right now :)

Jenn

cr500_af
07-17-2010, 9:15 AM
Thanks, everybody. The number of flatworms appears to be minimal now, which is why I wanted to act before it gets bad.
Jenn, you sold Sandie some Prazi Pro last week. She used it according to the directions, but I actually see more now than before (on the glass at least).

I still can't spot any at all on the rocks, but I'm sure they are there. For a long time, they were on one single mushroom, and I looked closely but never saw any anywhere else. Now there are maybe 25 on the glass, still about 20 on that shroom, and an unknown number of "no-see-ums" on the rock.

JennM
07-17-2010, 9:19 AM
That's odd. We've used PraziPro with good results. Did she treat the tank, or dip the rock etc.?

Did you do a FW dip on the mushroom they like? That will get them off in just a few seconds, but it won't take care of the ones on the glass, of course.

Jenn

jmaneyapanda
07-17-2010, 9:20 AM
My tank crashed after using Flatworm eXit.

However it was not user error, nor was it the product itself.

I had such a severe infestation that the toxins from the sheer numbers of dead flatworms, caused my tank to crash.

http://www.thereeftank.com/forums/f71/flatworm-exit-so-far-so-good-16537.html?highlight=Flatworm+eXit

There's another option too. Prazi Pro.

Jenn

I dont think Prazi pro works against red planaria flatworms. Against other polyclad flatworms, etc, it may be sueful, but it doesnt harm the typical ones.

JennM
07-17-2010, 9:22 AM
We've used it... in fact I used it after you told me it's safe in a reef (I've used it for trematodes) - and we saw an improvement in the flatworm situation. I can't say with absolute certainty that it got rid of 100% of them, but it sure knocked a hole in the population.

Jenn

Schwaggs
07-17-2010, 10:04 AM
Not really what you are asking for but I have used Flatworm exit and it is very effective. I recently tried a competing product, Flatworm RX but found that it did not work at all compared to FW Exit. Also, I have not been able to rid my system of FW despite several treatments to the whole system. They die during each treatment but always manage to come back several months later.

JennM
07-17-2010, 10:28 AM
They are like cockroaches.

Amici
07-17-2010, 10:34 AM
I didnt have a great experience with it. My tank didnt crash but it didnt kill them. I followed the directions to a T and even upped the dose substantially from the normal dose. A good number die but they always come back in a couple weeks. I finally bought a Melanarus, yellow coris and target mandarin. :)

Barbara
07-17-2010, 10:35 AM
Not really what you are asking for but I have used Flatworm exit and it is very effective. I recently tried a competing product, Flatworm RX but found that it did not work at all compared to FW Exit. Also, I have not been able to rid my system of FW despite several treatments to the whole system. They die during each treatment but always manage to come back several months later.

This was always my problem too. I used FW exit 3 times in a row; the first time at normal dosage, the second and third times at 2 x the dosage. All 3 times I had 100% survival rate (no deaths of corals, fish or inverts), but all 3 times the flatworms came back. Added a small six line wrasse and no flatworms for over 2 years in the same tank.

I vote six line wrasse.

cr500_af
07-17-2010, 11:09 AM
I have a target mandarin, but I thought they were just pod-eaters... I'd put it in her tank in a heartbeat (easier to see it there anyway) but I don't think she has the pod population to support it if it doesn't eat the FWs.

Anyway, Jenn, she treated the tank according to the directions. I have FW dipped their favorite shroom, but obviously they weren't all on there.

merkywater
07-17-2010, 1:02 PM
Can anyone provide a picture of these flat worms, or know a link to go to? I have some sort of worm in my tank but it doesn't have bristles like a bristle worm. It seems to be long and have many legs. Doesn't seem to be bothering anything. I have however seen it consume a dead snail. Just want to make sure it's not a flat worm.

Thanks Nate

JennM
07-17-2010, 1:07 PM
That sounds like a bristleworm, Nate.

Let me find some pix...

This is a bristleworm:

http://www.reefs.org/hhfaq/worms/faq_bristle.jpg/variant/medium

This is a red planarian or flatworm (the ones being discussed here)

http://www.3reef.com/forums/attachments/coral-health/15067d1240176993-red-sps-bugs-flatworms.jpg

Edit: This is a Eunicid worm (what Charlie just suggested).

http://nathistoc.bio.uci.edu/Annelids/Eunicid1.jpg

Jenn

Amici
07-17-2010, 1:07 PM
Can anyone provide a picture of these flat worms, or know a link to go to? I have some sort of worm in my tank but it doesn't have bristles like a bristle worm. It seems to be long and have many legs. Doesn't seem to be bothering anything. I have however seen it consume a dead snail. Just want to make sure it's not a flat worm.

Thanks Nate

Rut Roo......Sounds like Eunicid Worm. Its about mid way down. They eat fish....

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-04/rs/index.php

These are the flatworms were talking about here.

http://www.3reef.com/forums/attachments/coral-health/15067d1240176993-red-sps-bugs-flatworms.jpg

merkywater
07-17-2010, 1:14 PM
Rut Roo......Sounds like Eunicid Worm. Its about mid way down. They eat fish....

http://reefkeeping.com/issues/2003-04/rs/index.php

These are the flatworms were talking about here.

http://www.3reef.com/forums/attachments/coral-health/15067d1240176993-red-sps-bugs-flatworms.jpg



Well definitely not flat worm. Also whats crazy it looks nothing like any of those pictures....it has a very pointy head from what I can tell and sand colored I will try and post a picture of it if I can ever get one.

Thanks Dawg for the quick reply!

Nate

merkywater
07-17-2010, 1:17 PM
That sounds like a bristleworm, Nate.

Let me find some pix...

This is a bristleworm:

http://www.reefs.org/hhfaq/worms/faq_bristle.jpg/variant/medium

This is a red planarian or flatworm (the ones being discussed here)

http://www.3reef.com/forums/attachments/coral-health/15067d1240176993-red-sps-bugs-flatworms.jpg

Edit: This is a Eunicid worm (what Charlie just suggested).

http://nathistoc.bio.uci.edu/Annelids/Eunicid1.jpg

Jenn


Thank you too Jenn for the quick reply!

It isn't red like a bristle I've had them before not same tank...sand brown with a pointy nose.

demifelix
07-17-2010, 2:34 PM
Just tagging along here. I have read that the white flatworm eats the red flatworm, and the white flatworms are less troublesome. Is that true?

cr500_af
07-17-2010, 2:54 PM
The fw's I have are not red planaria. They are more oval shaped (no "pointiness" at all like the ones in the pic above) and they are a light tan... very "caucasian" color.

Acroholic
07-17-2010, 4:12 PM
Barry,
I had them in my chalice tank. I used FW Exit and followed the instructions. Mine came back just like Charlie said. I think it kills the adults but not the babies. They might be hiding in the recesses of the LR so are not exposed as much the adults, perhaps? If yo do use it, siphon as many out as you can before you treat, and get as many after you treat.

I treated like 4x with FW exit, and finally gave up 'cause it was looking like a waste of money.

Mine eventually went away on their own. I think they are a response to an increased food source within the tank, either too much feeding, something dying they are feeding on, or a combination of the above.

You might look at reducing your feeding, and increasing water changes and prefilter maintenance. Then see if their population settles out. Mine just went away after a while.