View Full Version : Boxes or Buckets


Seachem
08-10-2009, 1:14 PM
Some hobbyists have expressed interest in purchasing salt in large boxes (200+ gallons worth of salt mix, but split up into smaller bags) vs. buckets. We would like to see if this is what the majority of you prefer. Please participate in the poll and let us know whether you like boxes or buckets more. Thanks in advance for your participation!

jeep9783
08-10-2009, 1:18 PM
I prefer bucketts as you can never have enough

Seachem
08-10-2009, 1:26 PM
Thanks so much for taking the time to give us your input!

kevheng
08-10-2009, 1:29 PM
i prefer the buckets.

Amici
08-10-2009, 1:30 PM
That depends. Typically when the company does not incur the cost of the buckets, boxed salt is a bit cheaper. If Seachem Reef was available in a box with bags and its cheaper, I prefer that.

blu_devl_06
08-10-2009, 1:35 PM
Love the buckets, where do you put the salt if you don't have the capacity to mix a lot at once? Plus, buckets are very useful, and easier to carry....

Amici
08-10-2009, 1:45 PM
Love the buckets, where do you put the salt if you don't have the capacity to mix a lot at once? Plus, buckets are very useful, and easier to carry....

Yeah but you get to a point where your stack of buckets is as tall as you and you end up giving fish and frags away in buckets. I would prefer more salt for the same price and less glorious packaging personally.

ares
08-10-2009, 1:45 PM
Id like the option of boxes myself. I go through alot of salt, and have purchased both bags and buckets. for my needs, the bags are easier (I can easily pick up the bag and pour salt out of it, buckets are heavy and hard to control the pour).

its historicly about 25% more expensive to buy 4 bags vs 1 bucket. so I ussually end up with buckets since I go through 1.5 buckets a month, it adds up. (as do the buckets)

if I could get 4 bags in a box for the same price as a bucket, Id opt for that most of the time.

Miami Dolfan
08-10-2009, 1:46 PM
I agree with Dawgdude. I prefer the boxes if it will save some $$ in the long run. Besides, I already have 8+ buckets to mix in.

EnderG60
08-10-2009, 1:50 PM
I like the buckets, but if it saves on cost, ill do a box of bags no problem.

Just out of curiousity, what ever happened to the big barrels of salt you used to offer? Memories of being able to go to the LFS and refill my seachem bucket...that was nice.

acroporas
08-10-2009, 2:05 PM
Without a doubt, I prefer my salt in a bucket. Salt, it's all about the bucket. But I really wish the salt manufacturers would go back to using the "tall" buckets like they did in the good-ol-days. I don't use seachem salt, but if it came in a "tall" bucket, it would be enough to make me switch.

Ohh, and the lids...Go back to the snap on lids. The first screw on lid that IO used was great (the one with a release lever that was introduced at the same time as they moved to the smaller bucket) but the current screw on lids that everyone uses now are just awfull - they are harder to open than the snap on lids were.

DannyBradley
08-10-2009, 2:10 PM
High volume users need the boxes. My mixing container is 225 gallons with a 6" hole at the top. A bag is simple to open and pour in whereas buckets make a mess. I use multiple bags at a time, and very rarely partial bags.

Buckets are ideal for lower volume users as they provide a moisture free environment for storing your salt. Moisture will start reactions between the components of salt because of it being a concentrated environment.

I vote boxes, but ideally, providing both is preferable.

mufret
08-10-2009, 2:11 PM
I like the boxes. I have two 55 gallon drums that I use to mix my NSW. I have the barrels marked off to give me a pretty consistent 1.025 mixture using the 50 gallon bags.

ankur1113
08-10-2009, 2:12 PM
I rather have bucket of 200g then having few boxes laying around. Unless you have big boxes that will handle 200g and be able to seal it tight, then I dont mind box.

Amici
08-10-2009, 2:18 PM
I rather have bucket of 200g then having few boxes laying around. Unless you have big boxes that will handle 200g and be able to seal it tight, then I dont mind box.

I assume it would be something like 4x50g bags in a box?

I agree with Danny that there is a market for each. The normal hobbyist would prefer buckets but anyone using large amounts of salt would opt for boxes.

chauwall
08-10-2009, 2:34 PM
I like the bags in a box better for long term. They are easier to use and pour. Less heavy for the gals to lift :). And once you get 1 bucket, you can easily refill it if you don't use a whole bag. Plus, I would assume it's better for the environment with less trash waste. And of course if it is more cost effective, I'd buy it over a bucket.

Leslie
08-10-2009, 2:38 PM
Because I am just a hobbyist, using buckets is easier as I can scoop what I need and the rest remains moisture free till the next week. Bags are hard to handle when you're not using the entire bag. And buckets are easy to carry.

JDabs
08-10-2009, 2:39 PM
The bag is easier, but it's nice to have the bucket to keep things sealed. If the price comes down though I'm all for the boxes. I can figure out a way to keep it sealed and away from moisture.

Acroholic
08-10-2009, 2:46 PM
I prefer whichever packaging method makes your product the least expensive.

After a while, I have more buckets than I know what to do with.

With your boxes, I'd just empty the bags into a bucket I already have.

I'd be happy to field test your new formula!:D
Dave

DannyBradley
08-10-2009, 3:07 PM
After a while, I have more buckets than I know what to do with.


See if your LFS will give you credit on them. I had a guy that ran a deli that used to trade in tons of 5g buckets for credit. Granted you can never get rid of the pickle smell, they worked great for live rock.

cr500_af
08-10-2009, 3:28 PM
I like buckets just for the resealability... but once I have a good stock of them I'd buy boxes IF they price per gallon was cheaper.

ares
08-10-2009, 3:29 PM
With your boxes, I'd just empty the bags into a bucket I already have.


this is important. granted, buckets are nice to have, but the day will come when you have 10 buckets stacked up and still need salt. and a box may be nice to have as an option, just open the bags and pour it into an empty bucket. kind of like those crazy canadians that put their milk in a bag.

also, perhaps more of a question, but I once ordered like 20 bags from Dr Foster, and they sent me it in boxes... 4 bags in a box. so it seems like its already packaged like that? guess its just not branded and polished for retail sale. and unfortunatly I got no bulk discount for buying them by the box. it was great though, easy to store, no waste.

Amici
08-10-2009, 3:32 PM
Ive seen IO boxes but not any others that werent for "Store Use Only".

ericmcj31
08-10-2009, 3:39 PM
I prefer the buckets...but could be persuaded quite easily by offering a better price. If I ever needed another bucket, I'd just buy a bucket or two of the salt in the buckets....

theplatypus
08-10-2009, 4:31 PM
Bucket w/bags

stickx911
08-10-2009, 4:53 PM
Cut cost by reducing some material cost. If you produce boxes. It's almost clear its not for the beginner, so there is no need to have colorful boxes or ANY design on the bags inside. Just strong enough to hold themselves together so they can be poured into an old bucket, or just as Danny uses them, 100% into mixing. The bags wouldn't need to be resealable.

If it has to be one or the other. One idea may be to offer the box. But sell just empty seachem buckets on the side for $x.xx so that people like me can have something to put it in that's water tight.

Raz0945
08-10-2009, 5:47 PM
Bags if they are cheaper, I can always reuse my buckets!

ares
08-10-2009, 6:03 PM
home depot sells buckets for like 4$.

I have a suspicion that when its all said and done though, the cost of packaging is negligible between the 2, maybe a dollar or 2 different. Id still opt for boxed bags even if it were the same. its the small quantity price premium that keeps me away from individual bags designed for small tanks I guess. and no price breaks for buying lots of them..

for those that use alot of salt, I think wanting bags common. We end up with lots of buckets and can actually make use of 50g of salt at a time, so bags are ideal. Ever tried to pour salt from a 160g bucket? lol, its heavy and youd better have a wide opening, nevermind that its ugly getting it lifted to the top of the 55g drum.

And lets be honest, attracting the business of the guys that use alot of salt would be good lol. though you probably already have most of that market anyway... but dont let that make you lazy! just take the bags you already have in the boxes they are already in and put a barcode on them!

mysterybox
08-10-2009, 6:18 PM
I prefer buckets, and I use Seachem Reef. Since most people recycle them, they seem better for the environment, too. IMHO.

stickx911
08-10-2009, 6:47 PM
home depot sells buckets for like 4$.

I have a suspicion that when its all said and done though, the cost of packaging is negligible between the 2, maybe a dollar or 2 different. Id still opt for boxed bags even if it were the same. its the small quantity price premium that keeps me away from individual bags designed for small tanks I guess. and no price breaks for buying lots of them..

for those that use alot of salt, I think wanting bags common. We end up with lots of buckets and can actually make use of 50g of salt at a time, so bags are ideal. Ever tried to pour salt from a 160g bucket? lol, its heavy and youd better have a wide opening, nevermind that its ugly getting it lifted to the top of the 55g drum.

And lets be honest, attracting the business of the guys that use alot of salt would be good lol. though you probably already have most of that market anyway... but dont let that make you lazy! just take the bags you already have in the boxes they are already in and put a barcode on them!

I only needed 5-6 scoops at a time. no lifting required :D

AndyMan
08-10-2009, 7:39 PM
I'm the same as stickx911 (small mixes)- I only make 15 gallons of salt at a time...
IF I had my druthers, 5 gallon bags would be ideal (multiple bags per box of course)

Much bigger than 5 gallons per bag and I would be emptying the extra from the bags into pre-existing salt buckets and scooping from there

All depends who you're trying to market to I suppose, yeah there's lots of people out there who mix massive amounts of salt at a time, there's equally as many (if not more) who mix small batches of salt

weaglereefer
08-10-2009, 8:25 PM
I prefer the bucket. I like the lid that I can close and when they're empty, I put supplies inside. I always seem to have acquired enough spare junk between buckets to fill up a new bucket. Then I can just stack them in the corner.

I'm a big guy, and personally don't have a problem maneuvering the whole bucket around, and could easily put it up to the top of my tank if I needed to for whatever reason. But I can understand that smaller people, my girlfriend for example, may have some difficulty moving a full bucket. I guess they'd be SOL and stuck buying smaller quantities.



My reccomendation would be to sell 2 sized bags of 5 gallons of mix and 10 gallons of mix (keep in mind that you'd want 5 gallons of mix at 1.025-1.026, not 1.020), with buckets next to them, and every 150gallons of mix you buy, you get a free bucket. Ideally the packaging would be small enough that you could fit all the bags into a bucket for easy carrying, and of course, it'd be nice if there was a price break at 200gallons or something.

DannyBradley
08-10-2009, 9:05 PM
Introducing multiple sizes of bags significantly increases cost. Not only are you purchasing more sizes, you're setting up another manufacturing line to fill them, creating the box art, printing the box art, and buying multiple sizes of boxes.

Keeping it simple reduces cost, which seems to be the main theme in this thread.

Amici
08-10-2009, 9:10 PM
Yeah I usually just grab a measuring cup and measure out 5g if thats all I am doing. You could even get ziplocks and make your own 5g bags.

weaglereefer
08-10-2009, 9:31 PM
Introducing multiple sizes of bags significantly increases cost. Not only are you purchasing more sizes, you're setting up another manufacturing line to fill them, creating the box art, printing the box art, and buying multiple sizes of boxes.

Keeping it simple reduces cost, which seems to be the main theme in this thread.


Not necessarily. Put the same label on the bag, save for a few letters/numbers and a line in the barcode. You could use the same machines to fill them and seal them if all you did was make the bag "taller" and adjust the timing of operations. You could also use the same boxes, you would just put one bag where you would have put two before. The cost increase would be negligible.

AndyMan
08-10-2009, 9:38 PM
Keeping it simple reduces cost, which seems to be the main theme in this thread.Danny, don't get me wrong, I can see where you're coming from BUT look at it from a different perspective (there's always "startup and packaging costs", Seachem have already gone thru this once with buckets, printing etc etc)...

When you take your "empty jug" to LFS for them to fill with saltwater... what size jug do you take? Can you say... NEW MARKETPLACE!!!

Remember, you and I are still going to buy in bulk anyways but if it's made EASIER for us to get the final result CONSISTENTLY, everyone wins!

Delloman
08-10-2009, 9:58 PM
Please let use buy 200g boxes i realy like the 50g bags they are the right amount for mixing trash cans that meany people use i have always wondered why OI will not sell there box's to costermers there so much easyer to use i also live in a small appartemt with a 150g tank and i still mix in a 55g can i realy dont want all thows buckets

AndyMan
08-10-2009, 10:21 PM
Not necessarily. Put the same label on the bag, save for a few letters/numbers and a line in the barcode. You could use the same machines to fill them and seal them if all you did was make the bag "taller" and adjust the timing of operations. You could also use the same boxes, you would just put one bag where you would have put two before. The cost increase would be negligible.Don't do multiple size bags, people are "end users" they'll get the different sized bags mixed up and think they've mixed a load using 5 gallon bags when they've actually added 10 gallon bags instead and end up almost nuking their tank

Acroholic
08-10-2009, 10:56 PM
Whatever anyone's opinion is, Fosters & Smith sells the 160 gallon bucket and the 200 gallon box of Instant Ocean for the same regular price of $44.99, and they tout the box as follows:

"200 gallon Professional Size Earth-Friendly Boxes."

All they did was get some color printing done to their store use boxes and start selling them to the public. The price break is in the box, so I would guess the 160 gallon bucket costs more to package.

Looks like the box is more green if you go by what they have on their site.

Delloman
08-10-2009, 11:42 PM
all the plastic has a haff life so box with 5g totel plastic bags ver. 2lb of plastic bucket

DannyBradley
08-11-2009, 6:51 AM
Not necessarily. Put the same label on the bag, save for a few letters/numbers and a line in the barcode. You could use the same machines to fill them and seal them if all you did was make the bag "taller" and adjust the timing of operations. You could also use the same boxes, you would just put one bag where you would have put two before. The cost increase would be negligible.

You have to consider though that every time you change what's being run on that line you're paying someone to change and run that line which may mean creating a new job which incurs labor, health, SS, 401k, etc. costs. You also have to offer discounts to retailers to get more SKUs on the shelf and to provide the shelf space for the product. Discounts are a cost and do get factored in to the overall price of the product, as the end user always pays all costs associated with manufacturing and distribution.

It also increases wear on the machine, time between runs, length of runs with more bags to fill, more bags to seal, more machine start and stop time, and a whole new set of operations that can fault.

There are a lot of continuous costs outside of the 'neglible' startup costs. All I'm saying is that most people seem to want a better cost:gallon ratio and keeping it simple produces that result.

mojo
08-11-2009, 8:52 AM
I prefer boxes all day long. Anyone who goes through a lot of salt will because the number of buckets gets to be unwieldy. I agree with all the other opinions here, although half the reason I choose the boxes is because I can easily recycle the box / bags. The buckets may be recyclable, but they inevitably get used for something else (cat litter, etc), and then just thrown out.

The fact that Seachem might find most interesting is that I switched salt brands to IO because of the box option. I doubt I'm the only one.

AndyMan
08-11-2009, 9:05 AM
The fact that Seachem might find most interesting is that I switched salt brands to IO because of the box option. I doubt I'm the only one.Chris, do you "scoop" to measure or just dump the bag(s) in RO water?

DannyBradley
08-11-2009, 9:27 AM
The fact that Seachem might find most interesting is that I switched salt brands to IO because of the box option. I doubt I'm the only one.

That's what I did when running retail, and that's why I do it for maintenance. I dose to make up for it not being Seachem salt, but I'd rather not have to. The ease of use for me is too important when I'm prepping and finalizing my work days.

mojo
08-11-2009, 9:29 AM
I currently have a 65g make up container, so I dump one bag in directly, then scoop the rest. Typically, I use an old salt bucket to hold what I need for bringing it up to 1.026.

Incidentally, I'm about to replace my sump with a 300g tank. I'm partitioning it out so that I have a 100g reservoir for water changes. Because two 50g bags of salt is slightly less than 1.026, I'll be setting my float valve to the point where I *can* just dump in two bags of salt and be close enough to my target. Should make WC's a little bit easier...

Rbredding
08-11-2009, 10:47 AM
whatever is better for the environment... I can adjust as long as the price is equal or better....

mfliin
08-14-2009, 11:08 AM
Whatever gets me the cheapest price for the most salt. I purchase at least 10 buckets per year, just to get the discount....but it would be nice to have the bulk available. bulk meaning larger that 200 gal. of salt mix. I might even go for a pallet like the GA aquarium does, but I can't seem to find it!

It seems like buckets get expensive after a while....

ares
08-14-2009, 12:09 PM
larger than 200 makes storage and distribution a real pain I suspect.. not sure how many LFS are set up for freight delivery, most wouldnt fit it through their front door. a 10g bucket of salt would be mighty heavy...

Seachem
08-14-2009, 3:49 PM
Thank you to all who participated in the poll! We really appreciate your input :-)

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 8:58 PM
WOW! Who would have thought reefers would be in favor of plastic buckets rather than earth friendlier boxes and bags! ALMOST 2::1 in favor of buckets?

What does this tell everyone?

Looks like other manufacturers didn't listen to ARC... (wonder why!!)

Anyone NEED BUCKETS to store their boxed salt in, I've got 3 spares available, and even more "homer buckets" if you need them for salt storage!!! (JUST pm me, I'll hook you up)

weaglereefer
08-14-2009, 9:04 PM
You mean metal and plastic aren't recyclable?

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 9:05 PM
You mean metal and plastic aren't recyclable? can you say "landfill" ?

weaglereefer
08-14-2009, 9:10 PM
Landphil! I've never thrown away a bucket, I always have a use for more. I do use a few to transport oil to a local store like Advance Auto to recycle. Nice to have that twisty sealing lid for the messy stuff.

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 9:33 PM
Landphil! I've never thrown away a bucket, I always have a use for more. I do use a few to transport oil to a local store like Advance Auto to recycle. Nice to have that twisty sealing lid for the messy stuff.Ever thought about re-using the bucket so you can use it more than once? I'M NOT GOING TO GET INTO A RECYCLING THREAD WHEN THE MAJORITY OF ARC USERS WOULD PREFER WHACKING GREAT PLASTIC BUCKETS OVER MINIMALISTIC PLASTIC BAGS and Corrugated Boxes

OK, look at it from a different perspective, what consumes less space... A cylinder for 200G or a box for 200G? Who wins?

weaglereefer
08-14-2009, 9:54 PM
Ever thought about re-using the bucket so you can use it more than once? I'M NOT GOING TO GET INTO A RECYCLING THREAD WHEN THE MAJORITY OF ARC USERS WOULD PREFER WHACKING GREAT PLASTIC BUCKETS OVER MINIMALISTIC PLASTIC BAGS and Corrugated Boxes

OK, look at it from a different perspective, what consumes less space... A cylinder for 200G or a box for 200G? Who wins?


I do use it more than once. Why would I throw it away? It takes a few oil changes, though, and I only change my Royal Purple every 6-7k miles.

As for what consumes less space, I've never purchased boxes, but have had a significant amount of physics and math, and I'm pretty sure equal amounts of salt take up equal spaces. Maybe you want buckets to be filled to the brim?

As for the offer for the free buckets, if it stands, I'd be happy to take some. I also use them to store cat food and litter (after rinsing well) so it's not sitting in a bag. My mom uses them for cat and dog food.

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 9:58 PM
I'll bring what I have spare to the BBQ (and show you what 200G of box looks like in comparison)

Rbredding
08-14-2009, 10:28 PM
I'll bring what I have spare to the BBQ (and show you what 200G of box looks like in comparison)
whithout knowing... I would bet that you could put the bags/box inside one of the buckets...

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 10:44 PM
YOU GOT IT, less packaging, less waste (from my standpoint anyways) au01st wants my extra buckets so he can change his Royal Purple (I personally change my Purple @ Autozone and they give me back my recycleable oil bucket) so I can use it next time

As for... but have had a significant amount of physics and math, and I'm pretty sure equal amounts of salt take up equal spaces. SO, you're saying that a cylinder is as effective at storing salt crystals as a cube/box (weights and volumes of same substance)? WHAT FREAKIN SKOOL DID YOU GO TO? LET ALONE PHYSICAL "WEIGHT" OF THE BUCKET (yeah, buckets do increase actual shipping costs as well) Have you measured the weight difference between a Plastic bucket and equivalent weight of box+empty bags?

Have you seen the adverts for "fixed price shipping" from USPS, if it fits in the box it ships for the same price regardless of weight? DUH!!!!! A cylinder IS NEVER going to be as effective a shipping method as a box

Rbredding
08-14-2009, 11:02 PM
maybe a bag with a handle in the top?

stickx911
08-14-2009, 11:10 PM
YOU GOT IT, less packaging, less waste (from my standpoint anyways) au01st wants my extra buckets so he can change his Royal Purple (I personally change my Purple @ Autozone and they give me back my recycleable oil bucket) so I can use it next time

As for... SO, you're saying that a cylinder is as effective at storing salt crystals as a cube/box (weights and volumes of same substance)? WHAT FREAKIN SKOOL DID YOU GO TO? LET ALONE PHYSICAL "WEIGHT" OF THE BUCKET (yeah, buckets do increase actual shipping costs as well) Have you measured the weight difference between a Plastic bucket and equivalent weight of box+empty bags?

Have you seen the adverts for "fixed price shipping" from USPS, if it fits in the box it ships for the same price regardless of weight? DUH!!!!! A cylinder IS NEVER going to be as effective a shipping method as a box

no need to get so passionate. I prefer a bucket because it is reusable. But I have not gotten to the point where I have more buckets than I need. If I do, I'd switch to boxes, but the resealable top is useful in so many ways. If all the reef companies switched to boxes I'd be pissed because I would like access to a good bucket as a box and a half used bag turns to a rock in about a week.

We do not all have the same situation, and while I could see someone who has been in the hobby for a long time, or someone who's needed other buckets in the past may not need any more, but most of us with smaller tanks or new to the hobby welcome the bucket into out house as it is much more valuable than a hard to carry box that dries the salt out too quick.

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 11:22 PM
As for what consumes less space, I've never purchased boxes, but have had a significant amount of physics and math, and I'm pretty sure equal amounts of salt take up equal spaces. Maybe you want buckets to be filled to the brim?

Think about it this way.......

(pi)r2h will never be (2r)2h

I suggest respectfully that you lookup your volume calculators and re-evaluate (let alone that your average "bucket" isn't actually a true cylinder, it's actually a cone) and that throws the calculation ever further off the mark

no need to get so passionate. I prefer a bucket because it is reusable. But I have not gotten to the point where I have more buckets than I need. UNFORTUNATELY, I've gotten to the stage where I've had to throw buckets away cause they are too bulky

stickx911
08-14-2009, 11:27 PM
Think about it this way.......

(pi)r2h will never be (2r)2h

I suggest respectfully that you lookup your volume calculators and re-evaluate (let alone that your average "bucket" isn't actually a true cylinder, it's actually a cone) and that throws the calculation ever further off the mark

ignoring the shipping scenario. because you are right, shipping a box is easier than a bucket, but mathematically 200g worth of salt takes up the same amount of "space" no matter what shape it is in. It's just a pain to ship a bucket because it's harder to stack on top of or around.

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 11:40 PM
I must be missing something

to ship 2000 Cubic inches of "something" in a cylinder takes a 14" diameter cylinder 13" high (14" square x 13" high as far as shipping calculators go)

and to ship the same volume in a 'box' is a 14" square box thats only 10" high

WHERE DID THE EXTRA 3" (ALMOST 20% difference on height go) ???? Ah, you got it... to the shipping company!!!

stickx911
08-14-2009, 11:50 PM
I must be missing something

to ship 2000 Cubic inches of "something" in a cylinder takes a 14" diameter cylinder 13" high (14" square x 13" high)

and to ship the same volume in a 'box' is a 14" square box thats only 10" high

WHERE DID THE EXTRA 3" (ALMOST 20% difference on height go) ????

it came off the corners. its a circle...again, to ship you'd just be looking at the width and height, and you're right, but its like the corners were cut off and stacked on top. You're just looking at it logistically which isn't wrong. It's the same cubic inches no mater what which is kind of what defines "space". so 2 cubic inches = 2 cubic inches...

AndyMan
08-14-2009, 11:54 PM
SO, given previous syatements, when is Seachem going to start shipping in plastic boxes rather than plastic buckets? EVERYONE WINS

The people who WANT BUCKETS get their buckets (even if they are now square buckets") and those of us who want to save money overall by shipping "boxes", effectively save because Seachem are going to save on overall volume of shipped product just by changing their packaging

YEAH, the 20% reduction in volumetric shipping might only be a 3 or 5% shipping discount but if it was passed on to "us" end users, Seachem could potentially give enough of a price break to end users that they could become the preferred supplier for local fish stores nationwide?? WHO KNOWS

ares
08-14-2009, 11:58 PM
just to throw this out here... since Ive had 4 boxes of seachem salt on hand once before.

it is the same volume, and but buckets dont condense well, I was easily able to stack 4 boxes in the corner, doing the same with buckets of salt would have had more wasted space, or been stacked 4 high which might not be safe?

in a world of square rooms and objects, round buckets do have some wasted space.

Id never support doing away with buckets though, bags are not for everyone, or even most. but by volume, since theyd be favored by those using more salt, might end up being a big seller by volume, even if its only to 10-20% of the buyers.

AndyMan
08-15-2009, 12:09 AM
bags are not for everyone, or even most. but by volume, since theyd be favored by those using more salt
DISAGREE, see my previous posts for details, I'm a small water changer... and bags "specifically made for smaller water changes" could make it easier to sell larger quantities to the likes of me, especially if I don't have to "measure" the salt because I'm only making 5, 10 or 15 gallons at a time

DannyBradley
08-15-2009, 7:51 AM
DISAGREE, see my previous posts for details, I'm a small water changer... and bags "specifically made for smaller water changes" could make it easier to sell larger quantities to the likes of me, especially if I don't have to "measure" the salt because I'm only making 5, 10 or 15 gallons at a time

Wouldn't that create more plastic, more toxic printing dyes, and more manufacturing waste creating a larger carbon footprint for all those smaller bags? Man, that sounds terrible for the environment. :goodjob:

Delloman
08-15-2009, 8:17 AM
i really hope seachem will have buckets and boxes as 50gal bags are nice to have

i use the bags and as long as you close them (fold over or zip tie or clip you get the idea) they don't clomp up i leave open bags next to my mixing can and they still don't clump its not that bad unless you let water in the bag also as soon as it is in the mixing bucket(55gal can) it brakes up so who cares if it clumps

stickx911
08-15-2009, 8:18 AM
Wouldn't that create more plastic, more toxic printing dyes, and more manufacturing waste creating a larger carbon footprint for all those smaller bags? Man, that sounds terrible for the environment. :goodjob:

and those bags would not be re-usable like the buckets.

stickx911
08-15-2009, 8:21 AM
i really hope seachem will have buckets and boxes as 50gal bags are nice to have

i use the bags and as long as you close them (fold over or zip tie or clip you get the idea) they don't clomp up i leave open bags next to my mixing can and they still don't clump its not that bad unless you let water in the bag also as soon as it is in the mixing bucket(55gal can) it brakes up so who cares if it clumps


It's much more difficult to measure, and it gets fairly messy. I used to buy cheap stuff that was in a bag in a box, and by the second water change I had to brake off chunks and hope it was close to the right amount.

Delloman
08-15-2009, 8:32 AM
lol with the 50gal bags i dont have to measure and i just dont buy cheap salt :D

Miami Dolfan
08-15-2009, 8:40 AM
I say just manufacture less buchets but make them available to those who need them. Then again, you can always go to Home Depot and get a bucket and lid for $6. I have 8 extra buckets that had salt in them and agree that after a while, you really don't need anymore. If we did a group buy on the boxes, do you realize how many more units can be shipped on a pallet using the boxes compared to the buckets? Probably about 15% more.

Schwaggs
08-15-2009, 9:23 AM
Some hobbyists have expressed interest in purchasing salt in large boxes (200+ gallons worth of salt mix, but split up into smaller bags) vs. buckets.

The OP's concept is the 200G Box would have multiple bags in the box. Since they already make 50 gallon bags, it seems logical that they would put 4 of these into a box.

I love this idea since I usually perform 100-150 gallon water changes and I can keep a portion of the salt factory sealed avoiding moisture contamination.

I have always bought salt in buckets, I never really considered boxes until now...

stickx911
08-15-2009, 9:38 AM
lol with the 50gal bags i dont have to measure and i just dont buy cheap salt :D

agreed. I learned that lesson quick. But I did 5 gallon changes, so I did have to measure, and that 50g bag would last 10 weeks almost in my house.

Acroholic
08-15-2009, 9:47 AM
For Instant Ocean and Reef Crystals, three level cups should give 5 gallons of water a specific gravity of 1.026. Whether is is Seachem or IO/RC, it is easy to find and measure the volume needed for your desired SG one time, then just measure that amount from then on. A plastic measuring cup will last you forever.

Resealable, airtight containers can be purchased from The Container Store once and used to keep your boxed/bagged salt in. So I don't see the need for constantly buying buckets of salt when you can do the above and buy boxed salt and get a better deal and help the environment?

Rbredding
08-15-2009, 10:04 AM
i really hope seachem will have buckets and boxes as 50gal bags are nice to have

i use the bags and as long as you close them (fold over or zip tie or clip you get the idea) they don't clomp up i leave open bags next to my mixing can and they still don't clump its not that bad unless you let water in the bag also as soon as it is in the mixing bucket(55gal can) it brakes up so who cares if it clumps


why not just open a bag and pour it into any buckets you've got laying around? (like the windex refills that don't go to the cost to have a pump with them)

ares
08-15-2009, 10:12 AM
DISAGREE, see my previous posts for details, I'm a small water changer... and bags "specifically made for smaller water changes" could make it easier to sell larger quantities to the likes of me, especially if I don't have to "measure" the salt because I'm only making 5, 10 or 15 gallons at a time

if they make smaller bags in the box like 5, 10, or 15g. but didnt see any mention of that on the table... 4 50g bags would not be very useful for you...

cdub
08-15-2009, 10:55 AM
dont forget about the space required by a company to store the empty boxes vs. buckets prior to production. working in a manufuacturing plant i can say a pallet of 300 flat unfolded boxes takes up a lot less space than 300 empty buckets.

i think if boxes were readily available and cheaper most people would buy a bucket or two then buy boxes and fill their buckets back up.

Rbredding
08-15-2009, 11:00 AM
dont forget about the space required by a company to store the empty boxes vs. buckets prior to production. working in a manufuacturing plant i can say a pallet of 300 flat unfolded boxes takes up a lot less space than 300 empty buckets.

i think if boxes were readily available and cheaper most people would buy a bucket or two then buy boxes and fill their buckets back up.
agreed!!

I think that if we didn't have the option anymore, people would gripe about it.. but if we never had the option in the first place.. people wouldn't say anything at all...

all that being said.. I was reading back over the "what salt do you use" poll from a while back... it certainly seems that people buy salt for it's inherent qualities, not the packaging..

the important thing is that SEACHEM should know that it's probably not going to lose customers over the long term because it changes the packaging, like it would if it changed the mixture...